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When guitarist Dino Cazares was ousted from Industrial Metal icons Fear Factory under ‘...less than amicable...’ circumstances following the release of the group’s abysmal 2001 effort Digimortal, many, myself most definitely included, wondered what would become of the woefully-underrated axeman. Fortunately for all parties involved, Cazares wasted little--if any--time launching the Melodic Death Metal project Divine Heresy (which also features former Nile bassist Joe Payne and ex-All The Remains drummer Tim ‘The Missile’ Yeung), unleashing the group’s stunning full-length debut Bleed The Fifth in 2007. Now, a mere two years and one line-up change later (i.e. ex-Snot vocalist Tommy 'Vext' Cummings), the quartet has at long last returned with the oft-ingenious Bringer Of Plagues…
Todd: What was the main catalyst behind the reconciliation of your personal and professional relationships with Burton? From a rather confused outsider’s perspective, it seemed as if everything had reached an impasse…
Dino Cazares: “I had heard through people that actually worked for Fear Factory that Burton had wanted to talk to me and I was like ‘Oaky. Have him give me a call or something’, ya know? He didn’t call me, but we ran into each other at a Ministry show. He was on tour with Ministry and he came up to me. It wasn’t really a surprise to me because everyone had told me he wanted to talk to me, ya know? …So we had a few beers, started talking and it was like ‘Why were we mad at each other? I don’t remember’. …If you’re going to be a in a band for thirteen years, you’re going to fight eventually, ya know? And that’s exactly what happened. Neither of us even remembers what the whole argument was about (laughs). It was probably over something stupid (laughs). …So we patched things up, we kept in contact while he was on tour with Ministry and talked for a few months. Eventually, he approached me about doin’ the reunion and I was most definitely all for it.”
Todd: Having not worked together for several years, did you find that your chemistry with Burton was intact?
Dino: “Before Fear Factory, Burton and I actually had a band called Ulceration, so some of the songs that we wrote for that old band ended up on the first Fear Factory record. …They ended up on both (2002’s posthumously released) Concrete and (1992’s) Soul Of A New Machine. There were three songs that Burton and I had already written, so we already had that kinda thing goin’, ya know? Then, of course, I met (former drummer) Raymond (Herrera) at a record store, we started talkin’ and I heard him play and I was like ‘Wow, this guy’s great with a double bass’ and that’s how it all kinda came together. …We never really had a permanent bass player until (former guitarist/bassist) Christian (Olde Wolbers) came into the band. On the first two albums, I handled most of the bass duties. It wasn’t until (1998’s) Obsolete and (2001’s) Digimortal that Christian was able to make a little bit bigger contribution to the writing. It was more so on Digimortal than it was on Obsolete. Obviously, things eventually went sour and so on and so forth. History is history, ya know?”
Todd: Have you found the rumors and allegations surrounding the group’s current state to be a true distraction?
Dino: “Burton and I are remaining positive regardless of the rumors that are goin’ around out there. We’re keeping very focused on the record and are just trying to complete it. ...I haven’t been in the band for the last six or seven years, so I haven’t spoken to Christian or Raymond for a very long time. For me, the decision was easy. For Burt, it may be a different story, I don’t know. When you don’t have any connection or communication with somebody for a long time, it’s probably a little bit easier, ya know? For Burton, it was probably a little more difficult because I know he had been talking to those guys regarding a whole reunion.”
Todd: Musically and lyrically, how does the forthcoming Fear Factory record compare to the group’s previous efforts? Is there a particular release or era the new material is reminiscent of or is there an entire new direction?
Dino: “I would say that it has the energy of the first two albums (Soul Of A New Machine and 1995’s Demanufacture), but there’s definitely a lot of fresher ideas mainly because since I’ve been out of the band, I’ve ventured off and done stuff that’s a little bit more extreme than what I’ve done in the past. The early Fear Factory records are pretty extreme. There are some Death Metal elements on Soul Of A New Machine. It’s Death Metal-inspired Industrial music. I obviously ventured away from that for a while, but I eventually came back to it with my other bands Asesino and Divine Heresy. I believe I’ve brought a lot a lot of those elements back to Fear Factory, kind of like it was in the beginning. Of course when you’re playing with somebody as talented as (ex-Dark Angel/Testament drummer) Gene Hoglan, you know it’s gonna be pretty intense (laughs). His drumming is pretty intense, so to keep up with those guys… And they also have their own elements that they bring to the table as well, ya know? Especially when playing with (bassist) Byron (Stroud). He’s been in Strapping Young Lad and that stuff’s pretty crazy. I think it brings a whole new fresh vibe to it. I think it modernizes it a little bit, ya know? But at the same time, it doesn’t sacrifice what Fear Factory was, ya know?”
Todd: As far as the various production and mixing duties are concerned, who has the group opted to work with?
Dino: “Greg Reely (Frontline Assembly and Skinny Puppy, among others) is mixing the record and Rhys Fulber is producing the record. Rhys Fulber has always been one of those quiet fifth member type of guys, ya know? He’s been there since the first album and he did our first remixes on the Fear Is The Mindkiller EP back in 1993. Rhys and Greg Reely mixed Demanufacture after Colin Richardson was fired from the mix. They then both did Obsolete and Rhys handled some of the production duties on Digimortal, so we feel really comfortable with him. He understands what we want to do, so it was only natural for us to get those two back.”
Todd: You fired Colin Richardson? Why? It would seem as if his previous work literally speaks for itself…
Dino: “We fired Colin because he had started to mix the album and he kinda buried the keyboards a little bit. It was starting to sound like a whole different band and a whole different album. It had started to sound like a lot of the stuff that he had done before. Some of that stuff is great, but it wasn’t our sound, ya know? So unfortunately, things didn’t work out. We basically ended up re-mixing the entire record with Greg and Rhys and it ended up comin’ out just sick. It ended up comin’ out sounding exactly as we had wanted it to all along.”
Todd: Did you and Burton initially find it difficult to recapture the ‘…magic…’ of the group’s early recordings?
Dino: “Not at all. I just think Burton felt where I was comin’ from and I kinda felt where he was comin’ from and it just naturally felt right, ya know? We were both very excited when we started jammin’ together and were really excited to start jammin’ with Byron and Gene. I think when we got into a room together, ideas just started to fly out. It was like ‘Wow, this is startin’ to come out pretty heavy’. I just think it’s where we’re at right now, ya know? I think it’s where I’m at and I think it’s where Gene is at. He’s been doin’ (the soundtrack to the acclaimed Cartoon Network animated series) Dethklok and that’s pretty heavy. I think that’s where we’re definitely at and Burt fell right into it and feels great about it. He’s also doin’ some pretty heavy stuff as well.”
Todd: Have the songwriting and recording sessions for the new Fear Factory record been a collaborative effort?
Dino: “Yes. Definitely. Everyone has pulled in their ideas and it’s been great. …It’s gonna be fuckin’ amazing. It’s going to be one of those records that when you hear it, you’re like ‘This is what it’s supposed to be like’, ya know? Burton has got some great hooks and he’s got some amazing lyrics. He’s got some really cool topics and I don’t want to tell you about them because it’s too early to talk about that stuff and you’re gonna as about them later, anyway (laughs). It’s some really amazing stuff. I hadn’t worked with Burton on the last two records (2004’s Archetype and 2005’s Transgression), but I listened to some of the lyrics and thought they were pretty good. But this stuff is just amazing. I’m like ‘Where is this stuff coming from?’ …Burton has always been one of those guys that’s been able to pull out a concept and just really focus in on it.”
Todd: Objectively speaking, how do you feel regarding the music contained on Archetype and Transgression?
Dino: “I thought some of the riffs on Archetype were very, very similar if not exactly like some of the things I had done in the past. Regarding Transgression, I don’t really know what to say about that record. I don’t think it was a very well-focused album. From what Burt tells me, a lot of weird shit was goin’ down during the recoding of that record. I think they all just lost their focus. I’m really glad that Burt is in a really good place and we’re focused on what we’re doing now. That’s what these records really need, ya know? You can’t just throw a Fear Factory record together. …You really have to focus in, work on it and make it the best it can be.”
Todd: Prior to Byron and Gene becoming full-fledged members of Fear Factory, did you have any suggestions regarding who should replace Raymond and Christian? I would imagine you had more than a few ideas…
Dino: “I did, but it was already kind of set when I agreed to jam with Burton, ya know? Burton had already had a lot of talks with the other two guys about doin’ a reunion and after the other two guys pretty much refused a few times, I believe Burton already had ‘Plan B’ already set to go, ya know? By the time I agreed to jam with Burton, he already had Byron and Gene in place. …It wasn’t a pre-planned thing, but once he saw that Raymond was pretty much sayin’ ‘No’ and he told Raymond ‘Look, I’m going to continue on without you’, that was when Burt made the calls and got the other two guys. He then called me and said ‘Hey, I’ve got these two other guys’ and I was like ‘Okay, cool’. Why would I complain about jammin’ with Byron and Gene (laughs)? Why would I even think about anybody else at this point? I was like ‘Whoa! We got those guys? That’s even better!’ A lot of the drummers out there respect what Gene’s done over the years. He’s one of those guys that pretty much adapts to anything, ya know? But he also brings his own style to the music, which I love because his drumming is just phenomenal. Burton really could not have gotten a better guy for the job. ...I consider myself to be a kid in a candy store because I actually get to jam with Tim Yeung, ya know? I get to play with Tim Yeung and Gene Hoglan in two of the bands I play in, so the playing is just great. …It’s just so amazing.”
Todd: What is the current status of the legal proceedings surrounding the ‘usage’ of the Fear Factory moniker?
Dino: “I can’t really talk about a lot of that stuff. …All I can say is that Burton and I are moving forward and are very focused on finishing the record. The music is coming out amazing, ya know? I really can’t reveal a lot of what is going on with the legal proceedings, what the ramifications will be, what they are doing, what we’re doing or anything like that. All I can say is that we’re leavin’ it up to the lawyers so they can do their jobs. …There’s no reason for me to slag anybody off or to say what they’re saying is wrong or for them to say what we’re saying is wrong. I don’t need to get into that stuff. I let the people we pay to handle that stuff handle it.”
Todd: In hindsight, what were the main motivations behind recording Bringer Of Plagues with vocalist Travis Neal (ex-Pushed, The Bereaved)? What criteria did you ultimately adhere to when searching for a replacement?
Dino: “We had a different guy (ex-Snot frontman Tommy Cummings, a.k.a. Tommy Vext) who didn’t work out. I want to go back to the beginning with this. In the beginning, when I put Divine Heresy together, I didn’t really know anybody. I was basically picking people based solely on their talents. I was finding them on MySpace or sometimes, someone would recommend someone to me and I’d listen to their demo. So it was kinda like ‘Making The Band’, ya know? You don’t really know how people are going to turn out to be. What we found out as a band was that the first singer we had just didn’t work out. We fired him and we got Travis Neal. When we got Travis, we put him through a few tests. We took him out on tour with us to see if he could handle the rigors of the road…to see if he could handle how it is out there. …Basically bein’ in a van, loadin’ the trailer up, helpin’ out with the merchandise and so on and so forth. The road is now for everyone, which we found out the hard way. Travis really pulled through on it and really came through, ya know? We found out he’s a really good ‘Road Dog’, so we were very happy about that. We also put him through a second test, which was to write some songs with us. The first song we wrote was “Facebreaker” and when I saw how awesome it came out, so we officially welcomed him into the band. We put him through those tests because we didn’t want to make the same mistakes twice. Again, you don’t really know someone until you live with them and living with them is being out on the road. That’s when you really get to see who can handle this and who can’t and who gets along and who doesn’t get along. When you get put into a situation like that, sometimes you have to force things and it doesn’t always work out, especially when you’re playin’ with guys that you don’t know and especially when you’re out on tour with guys that you don’t know. Tim, (bassist) Joe (Payne) and I have all been in bands before. Joe was in Nile and Tim has been in numerous Death Metal bands, so they understand what it’s like to be out on the road. The previous singer we had…had never been out on tour doin’ it like they way we do it. It wasn’t something he could really handle, so we had to let him go. But we’re really happy that Travis has come through and you can obviously hear on the record that he did a really amazing job.”
Todd: Did the songwriting processes for Bringer Of Plagues differ from the processes for Bleed The Fifth?
Dino: “Yes, it definitely did. With the first record, I had written a lot of stuff prior to getting everyone in the band together, so it definitely had a lot of Fear Factory elements to it. …It didn’t have the influences of Tim Yeung or Joe Payne yet. Tim and I did write a few songs for the first record, but it wasn’t until this record that we all wrote together. It was more of a collaboration, ya know? It was a collaboration between Tim’s insane drumming style, Joe Payne’s amazing bass playing and of course Travis Neal. I’m really proud of how this record came out. Everybody did a great job, I can’t wait to do a new one and I can’t wait to go out on the road.”
Todd: At this point, have the intensities of your touring obligations with Divine Heresy had a negative impact on your abilities to complete work on the forthcoming Fear Factory record? It really is a rather hectic pace…
Dino: “Not yet (laughs). It hasn’t affected it yet. …The focus right now is on finishing the record. I think there was a lot of confusion regarding why we had cancelled the shows in Europe. Between me doin’ Divine Heresy and tryin’ to finish this album with Divine Heresy, working on the new Fear Factory album and rehearsing for live shows, there just wasn’t going to be any time. I was the one that said ‘Okay, we need to cancel these shows and finish writing this album.’ If I’m going to write a sick fuckin’ Fear Factory record with Burton, Gene and Byron, we were going to need the time. ...We realized that we needed to concentrate on it, so instead of tryin’ to make a quick buck, we stayed home and focused on what’s important. Divine Heresy is getting ready to do the Metal For The Masses tour, which is coming up in October and is going to be great. I don’t know what other bands have been conformed for it, but I’m sure it’s going to a killer tour. Century Media is putting together, so it’s going to be Century Media and Nuclear Blast bands as well. Obviously, whenever I get the opportunity, I’m going to put both bands, Fear Factory and Divine Heresy, on the same bill and hopefully tour together. I’ve done it before. I’ve toured with both Divine Heresy and Asesino on the same bill back to back. I’ve done it where I’ve played thirty five songs live and I’m gonna do it again on September 3rd, which is my Birthday show. I’m going to be forty three, by the way, not forty seven like a lot of people think I am. I’ll be playing to sets, Divine Heresy and Asesino, back to back at the Whiskey A Go Go in Hollywood. It’s going to be great. I can’t wait. It’s a yearly thing that I’ve done the last three or four birthdays, so it’s been really great.”
Select Discography
Bringer Of Plagues (2009) ****
Bleed The Fifth (2007) ****
Cristo Satanic (2006) ***
Corridos De Muerte (2000) ***
Concrete (2002) *
Digimortal (2001) *
Marijuana (EP) (2000) **
Brujerizmo (2000) **
Obsolete (1998) *
The Gabber Remixes (EP) (1997)
Burn (EP) (1997) *
Remanufacture (1997) *
Raza Odiada (1995) **
Demanufacture (1995) *
Matando Guiros (1993) **
Fear Is The Mindkiller (EP) (1993) *
Soul Of A New Machine (1992) *
* as a member of Fear Factory
** as a member of Brujeria
*** as a member of Asesino
**** as a member of Divine Heresy