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Acclaimed bassist Billy Sheehan (Talas, David Lee Roth, Mr. Big, and Devil’s Slingshot, among others), always a man of many words and interesting stories, was kind enough to take a break from his decidedly hectic schedule to speak with us regarding, among many other things, the release of his latest solo opus Holy Cow…
Todd: Prior to beginning the recording processes for Holy Cow, did you find it difficult to decide which musicians you were going to work with? Did you seriously consider working with an ‘outside’ vocalist?
Billy: “I never thought about any other vocalists. It wasn’t until the very end that I decided to us (King’s X vocalist) Dug (Pinnick) on “Turning Point”. I just thought he’d be perfect for it. …It’s a solo record, so it was designed for me to be solo. A lot of guys do solo records that have so many guests on them that it’s hard to tell whose record it is (laughs). All of my solo records have pretty much been mostly me. On my first solo record (2002’s Compression), I used (drummer) Terry Bozzio and (guitarist) Steve Vai, but I did everything else. On the second record, Ray Luzier played the drums and I did everything else and on this record, I had a couple of guests, but it was more for fun and they were available and I thought they fit the songs really well. I had already made my point by making a record almost entirely on my own, so I thought maybe it was time to invite a couple of people over. …You cannot go wrong with Ray Luzier on drums. He’s an up-and-coming superstar. Everyone that uses him on a recording just absolutely loves him. He’s just great in the studio. He’s real creative. …I tried to make this a real band experience even though it’s really just my thing. I prefer playing in a band, so having someone to bounce ideas off of… I was able to tell Ray ‘Do what you would do here. What would you do here? Don’t let me tell you how to play your drums. Just lay some Ray Luzier on me’ (laughs).”
Todd: What prompted you to become involved with the group Niacin? I’ll be the first to openly admit that I had doubts regarding the effectiveness of an instrumental Rock group that didn’t actually feature a guitarist…
Billy: “It actually came together because of Guitar World magazine. …Guitar World magazine contacted me and said they wanted me to do a track for their Guitar World magazine compilation CD. So I said ‘I’ve got an idea. I’ll do one with no guitars’ (laughs). So I got a friend of mine who is a Hammond B3 player and (Mr. Big/Robert Plant/Ritchie Kotzen) drummer Pat Torpey. Later on, we had the opportunity to take our time and choose a drummer for Niacin and we, of course, chose Dennis Chambers, who is my all-time favorite musician on any instrument. It was kinda cool because the world has become so guitar-centric. I was trying to skew it a little off that concept that it is a guitar world, ya know? I’d prefer it to be a music world populated by various musicians playing various instruments rather than all strings and threads on guitar, ya know? It was my little feeble attempt at doing it. …Dennis Chambers, as a drummer, is the best musician that I know. Playing with him in Niacin was a whole new world for me. He’s the best of the best. There’s probably three or four guys in the world that are considered the top of the heap as far as drumming goes and Dennis is certainly one of them and if you ask the other two or three guys, they’ll tell you it’s Dennis, too (laughs). …He really is incredible.”
Todd: What were the main motivations behind Mr. Big reuniting? I had always assumed, based solely on the rumors and half-truths that circulated in the press, that a full-fledged reunion simply would not be realistic…
Billy: “One of the beginnings of that was when Paul (Gilbert) played on Holy Cow on the song “Dynamic Exhilarator”. It was the first time we had worked in a studio together since we had been in Mr. Big together. We jammed a zillion times and we hang out together a lot because we’re both here in L.A., but we never actually thought about working together. When he came in to do the solo on “Dynamic Exhilarator”, we had a blast. It was awesome. He did a great, great solo. The first one is amazing and the second one somehow tops it (laughs). So after that, we had a little more organized jam here in L.A. when he played with his band. Ritchie Kotzen was there and Pat Torpey was there and we played a couple of Mr. Big songs. The crowd went out of their minds and we were like ‘The only thing that could top this is if (vocalist) Eric (Martin) was here’. So a couple of E-Mails started floating back and forth and the next thing you know, we said ‘Well, let’s get together and have dinner just to hang’ and right at that point, we just said ‘Yeah, let’s just do it’. The good thing about it is that nobody dangled cash in front of us. It didn’t come from outside of us. It wasn’t where someone had an idea and said ‘Yeah, let’s put your band back together. Let’s put you on a bus somewhere for six months before you break up again’. So it actually came from us, from our desire to really want to play together again and how much we loved the band. It was self-generated and organic in that respect, so now it’s going to happen again.”
Todd: Once the reunion commenced, how difficult was it to avoid the animosities and difficulties of the past?
Billy: “I didn’t notice a thing. We were together in Japan for a whole week in close quarters doing press for the upcoming tour, the upcoming releases and things like that and they had a hard time getting us from one room into the interview room because we were so busy telling stories about adventures we’ve had since the band and during the band. We had people around us the whole time. I remember asking the translator…I forget what her name was ‘You’ve been around us the whole time, translating everything. …You can tell people this is the real thing, right? And she says ‘Tell them? I’m going to write a book about it’. So we actually did have a great time. Most of the animosities of the past, the difficulties are like when you meet an old friend that you grew up with all through your youth, but for some reason, in the fifth grade, you had a fight and never talked to each other again. Well, when you get back together again, it’s like it never happened. It was very much like that.”
Todd: Did you feel Mr. Big lost some of its creative momentum once Paul Gilbert left the group? (ex-Poison axeman) Ritchie Kotzen was obviously a more than capable replacement, but it couldn’t have been the same…
Billy: “It never was. I love Ritchie. We all love Richie and we love what his contribution to the band was. We jammed again the other night. It was myself, Paul Gilbert, Ritchie, Pat Torpey and a couple of other people at the House Of Blues. We love Ritchie. He’s fantastic, but for me, whenever an original member of the band changes, it’s not the same band. I’m a fan. I’ve got sixty thousand songs on my iTunes and I’ve got three hundred gigs of tunes on my drive. I’m a big, big fan of a lot of bands and a lot of different music and it’s always thrown me for a loop when there’s been a personnel change. That’s why, for me, being in the band and having Paul quit was tough. Our choices were to either break up or bring in Ritchie. It just wasn’t the same band. Playin’ all the old songs was cool, but it’s not the same. ...Ritchie’s a more than competent guitarist. He’s a spectacular player with his own unique style, but at the same time, it just wasn’t the same. So to have the original line-up with Paul, Eric Martin, myself and Pat Torpey…that’s the real band. That’s the band that we got our success with. To me, that’s the real version of Mr. Big, but we still love Ritchie. He’s wonderful.”
Todd: At this point, are there any solidified plans for the Mr. Big reunion tour to expand beyond the Far East? With nostalgia being what it is, I would imagine a domestic-based excursion would be very well attended…
Billy: “Probably. I don’t know when, where or how, but that’s the plan. We’re pretty much just letting nature take its course at this point. Japan contacted us and wanted to book us, so we said ‘Okay’. Bands don’t usually choose where they play, they just play where people book them, so we’re entertaining a few offers to do different things, but one of the criteria that we laid down at the beginning of this reunion was that we’ll only do it if it’s enjoyable, people are actually going to get their money’s worth and it’s not going to be a weird, high-pressure situation where we’ll be playing in horrible, ugly and stinky places. We’ve paid our dues. In fact, I’ve overpaid my dues and actually got a little refund the other day which was nice. So it doesn’t bother us that we’ve made a little benchmark in regards to what we’d like to have. We’re not superstars asking for no brown M&Ms, but a couple of bottles of water backstage, we’ll bring our own wine, thanks and maybe a bowl of potato chips and some towels, but that’s all that we really need …We’ve never been like that. We just want it to be enjoyable for us and the audience as well. That’s our only criteria. …Stage, sound, lights and monitors and we’re ready to go, ya know? …With that said, any place that can provide that we’re happy to play. The list of countries that we’ve already gotten inquires from is incredible. It looks like the inbox of the United Nations. I’ve literally gotten request from Iraq and Iran, Malaysia, Indonesia, Thailand, Singapore, South Vietnam…”
Todd: Looking back, are you surprised that Talas didn’t eventually achieve mainstream commercial success?
Billy: “No. We progressed along the lines that everybody else did. We got to a point where we got looked at by a lot of labels, we got promised deals, those promises were broken, we got promised more deals and those promises were broken. But we were still expanding and doing well. We were getting better and expanding our reach. We knew it wasn’t going to be a quick overnight thing…it was far from an overnight thing. …I had to replace two of the original guys with other guys. The band was still good, but it just wasn’t the same, so when David Lee Roth called, asking me to join him, I said ‘Well, the only band I’d ever think of leaving Talas for is Van Halen, so if David Lee Roth calls, I guess that’s close enough’ (laughs). So that was it. I was done.”
Todd: Did you initially find it difficult to make the transition from the relative obscurity of Talas to truly high-profile exposure of playing with David Lee Roth at what was arguably the peak of his career as a solo artist?
Billy: “Well, it was quite a transition. …I had a ’77 (Ford) Pinto. You know those fake tires that come with new cars that you’re supposed to use in case you get a flat? It’s not a real tire and you’re only supposed to use it to drive like ten miles to get to the gas station to get in fixed? Well, I had that on my car for two years because I couldn’t afford to buy an actual tire. So I did my time with poverty. But we had fun, but boy were we poor. So I went to L.A. Dave flew me in. I was the first guy he called and we started planning a band. Within two nights, we were playin’ in a club and there were Paparazzi waiting there, so I went from driving my three wheeled Pinto to having my picture taken by Paparazzi comin’ out of a club (laughs). That’s quite a steep little curve there. ...It was an interesting time. We had a blast. The original guitarist was Steve Stevens (Billy Idol). That’s who Dave had in mind. It didn’t work out, so I told Dave ‘Hey, I know another Steve that would be just perfect’ and sure enough, he called Steve Vai and he came down. I love Steve Stevens. He’s great, but I think Steve Vai was the perfect fit for Eat ‘Em And Smile. He’s a wonderful guy. They’re all just fantastic. I just had dinner with him and all of the Eat ‘Em And Smile guys the other night. Of course it was minus Dave because we couldn’t find him, but it was still myself, Steve (drummer) Greg Bissonette and the keyboardist Brett Tuggle…all of the guys that we did the tour with. We’ve done it a couple of times where we have an Eat ‘Em And Smile reunion. We all sit down, have dinner somewhere and tell stories. It’s always a laugh riot…”
Todd: What ultimately led you to your decision to no longer work with David following the release of (1988’s) Skyscraper? Was there the proverbial ‘…creative differences…’, or was it something on a more personal level?
Billy: “Dave took a chance. He decided to try a new direction with the music. In a way he was right because he wanted to mix dance beats into the music. He was like ‘We need to be more Dance-orientated’. And I was like ‘That’s great, but…’ …It just wasn’t me. I just couldn’t get up there and do that kind of thing. So I was gone, but in a way he was right because Dance music did become the next giant thing and now that’s pretty much all there is. I call it Karaoke Aerobics. It’s basically people doing Karaoke because they’re singers who don’t really sing on their records and just get pitch-corrected. And then they get eight to twelve people to do Aerobics next to them and that’s ninety percent of the music that you see on TV now. So in a way, he was right, but the problem with doin’ a switch like that when you’re a Rocker guy is that the Rockers are going to hate you because you’ve turned on them and the Dance guys are going to hate you because you were once a Rock guy. …So unfortunately, he fell between the cracks, but in a way he was right. He accurately predicted that Dance music was going to come in. It did, but at the same time, we had a lot of other great music by a lot of other great bands. I just think he threw the dice and they just didn’t come up with the number he needed.”
Todd: Any truth to the rumors that you were approached regarding replacing Michael Anthony in Van Halen? In hindsight, it’s a seemingly logical move considering your connection to David Lee Roth as a solo artist…
Billy: “Yeah, I was. For a long time, I denied it because (former Van Halen bassist) Michael (Anthony) is a dear friend of mine. I love him so much. I was kinda caught in the middle. …It’s happened several times. Once right after we (Talas) toured with them in 1980, it happened again in ’82 after the Diver Down record, it happened again just before Dave called me…and then, when I was out of Mr. Big before the Gary Cherone thing (i.e. 1998’s abysmal Van Halen III) happened, I spoke with them and then I spoke with them again after that as well. So it’s happened a bunch of times. We’ve always been toying with it (laughs). I went over to Ed’s a couple of times and we jammed and talked about stuff. He’s such a wonderful guy. I would love to go out with just Ed and a drummer, ya know? …As much as I would have liked to be in the band, I didn’t want the band to change because I’m a fan of Van Halen. If Michael ain’t up there, it ain’t the same band, even if it’s me, ya know? But I’m sure if the opportunity would have gone further, I would have taken it. We talked about it seriously a couple of different times as several different points, but it never actually materialized. When they got back together with Dave and went out without Michael, I was kinda sad about it. So I’m very honored and I love all of those guys. …Alex, Eddie, Dave and Michael, I love them all completely and I wish they were all together again. At least Dave and Eddie are back together again. I’m happy about that, ya know? That’s how it goes. …Who knows what tomorrow will bring. I’m just glad they’re back together and hope they’re happy. I love Van Halen. I love all four of the Van Halens and they’ve all been a great, great influence on me.”
Todd: Commercially and musically, what do you feel has been your single greatest musical accomplishment?
Billy: “Basically, it was Talas, David Lee Roth and Mr. Big. There were a few other things in between, but I never really joined any other bands. I toured with UFO, I did a brief stint with Max Webster, (guitarist) Kim Mitchell’s great band and a few other little thing, but the only bands that I was really in were Talas, a brief stint in a band called Light Years, David Lee Roth and Mr. Big. …Mr. Big, of course, was my biggest success. It was more nine, of course, than David Lee Roth. David Lee Roth is Dave’s band, but that was my first taste of it, so that was incredible. It’s hard to pick one or the other. And the early years with Talas…most everything that I know now I learned back then (laughs), so they all hold a significant place. I’m glad to say that I’m still friends with everybody now after the smoke has cleared from Talas, David Lee Roth, Mr. Big and all points in between now. I’m really lucky to have those people as friends because they are some truly wonderful people.”
Todd: What are your current touring plans? Once your impending obligations regarding the Mr. Big reunion have been fulfilled, is it safe to assume you’ll be touring in support of Holy Cow as much as humanly possible?
Billy: “I’m hoping to get out this Fall. We’re going to be busy with Mr. Big in June, a little bit after that and in the Summertime, there’s a couple of things booked. I’m tryin’ to figure out what Ray Luzier’s schedule is going to look like. I would love to use him. Having him out there with me would be just perfect, so I’m going to try to work around his schedule a little bit (laughs). So hopefully I’ll get out and have not only Holy Cow but also (2002’s) Compression and (2005’s) Cosmic Troubadour, some Mr. Big stuff, some David Lee Roth stuff and some Talas stuff and maybe a UFO song here and there to pick from. The point of it is that it could be a very entertaining evening. Also, whoever I take out with me, I’ll pick the best that I can and the best that I can afford and make sure that they have a feature spot as well. I’m hoping to promote some great players as well.”
Todd: Taking into consideration the obvious diversity and complexity of the available choices, will you be handling the majority--if not all--of the lead vocals or will you be utilizing the talents of a full-time frontman?
Billy: “I don’t know. I’ll probably take somebody along with me that can sing. I’ve sang my whole entire life. I just haven’t needed to until I started making solo records. I sang lead on a couple of Talas songs back in the day, ya know? And back in the day when we were a copy band, I sang the (David) Bowie songs and the Judas Priest songs (laughs), so it was quite a range of vocals. If I can do the David Bowie stuff and the Judas Priest stuff, I guess I can do them all. In my delusions of less than grandeur, I fall somewhere between them all. …I’ve been archiving these old cassettes and I have these tapes of me hitting the high notes on “Breaking The Law” and “Diamonds And Rust” and all the other stuff that we used to do by Judas Priest, which is pretty cool.”
Select Discography
Holy Cow (2009) *****
Clinophobia (2007) ******
Cosmic Troubadour (2005) *****
Live: Blood, Sweat And Bears (2003) ****
Compression (2002) *****
Live In Japan (2002) ***
Actual Size (2001) ***
Time Crunch (2001) ****
Get Over It (2000) ***
Deep (2000) ****
Doin’ It Right (EP) (1998) *
Live In Buffalo (1998) *
If We Only Knew Then… (1999) *
High Bias (1998) ****
Live In Japan (1997) ****
Niacin (1996) ****
Hey Man (1996) ***
Bump Ahead (1993) ***
Lean Into It (1991) ***
Mr. Big (1989) ***
Billy Sheehan - The Talas Years (1989) *
Skyscraper (1988) **
Eat ‘Em And Smile (1986) **
High Speed On Ice (1985) *
Sink Your Teeth Into That (1983) *
Talas (1979) *
* as a member of Talas
** with David Lee Roth
*** as a member of Mr. Big
**** as a member of Niacin
***** as a solo artist
****** as a member of Devil’s Slingshot